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The map is generally too faily for no reason for a moderate map. Gerenade solo parts feel weird to me. Time cp 6 missing?

I thought there were too few possible fails

Add some unfreezes and deleted unused tiles

now fixed

Hi! Tested your map and ready to share some things, gonna say straight that it's decline, but I see some potential, you are trying to fix your map and uploaded it a few times already, so I tried to give maximum information in my feedback!

Kinda annoying that u have to take grenade again an again after fail, cuz it's kinda long to take it, and setup for the swing + grenade isn't really obvious, u can't say how much speed is gonna be enough to not to touch the left wall and have enough speed to make it through the freeze

Thanks bro

Atleast one guy who want to help me

More space all over the solo parts, all over the map itself, and this mentioned marked area itself here, cuz u intentionally want to use 2nd dj here, but if u do, u are just gonna touch tp, which is not cool. U should give more space on noobfilters, and noobfilter itself should be fast and simple, but tricky to actually "filter noobs", so this dj refills to take greenade is just not a right thing to have in noobfilter

More space also here, just addition to the previous screenshot and text, cuz i kept touching it every time

You can skip this dj refill also, and go straight left, and shotgun yourself 3 times to be able to go through the tunezone

This setup here feels kinda off, or just feels awkward, cuz u have to stop, setup your teammate, then hook it from the exact spot, make a few edges, which made u slow down a lot, but before that u had some "speed" and easy half of the part

Parts like this is ok if it's made not this big and uses a few UNFAILABLE tricky moves to go past, so making this you are actually gonna feel something "fun", but not just hook ur teammate for a 4-5 secs straight(unfailable cuz it's moderate, and your map have a lot of not really needed fail places, im gonna talk about it later)

Is a cool idea, but when you are trying to make it, u keep losing ur dj every time, which is not really cool(ok, even if you can think that it's skill issue by me, then atleast you can also mark what you have to do here maybe, cuz i see a few possible ways to go through this part)

Isn't cool to make players wait cuz they failed such a laser-thing, in a lot of times mappers just make u go to tp after u fail, so u can restart faster, or make the part so u have unfreeze, but u can't skip the laser

or make the freeze 1 or 2 seconds instead

Also part feels very simple and uncreative at all, space between hooks is shouldn't be that small, hook is 1.5s long if i remember it right, but u use like 0.4-0.5 for every rehook

Ngl i found this solos kinda fun and cool, even tho make them that close to each other feels repetitive

This transition is horrible, u can't really walk there cuz it's like a stairs, and it's awkward to hook also. U can make it some simple tunnel, or something else less stairs-looking xD

Solo is cool, BUT, the second half is just a jumps, and u take away grenade just to give it again on a few secs, which is not cool also, u can make the full solo with grenade, or atleast make the jumps more interesting, tho the problem with taking away grenade just to give it again still gonna be there.

And also add unfreezes wherever it's possible, never make players to wait if it's not necessary

U should delete and minimize all the stoppers and speeders that is not necessary also, u could've just make end of a freeze a bit left, so the speeder is not needed at all

And the gap between parts is very very small(map itself have a lot of spacing issues, gonna talk about it later also)

Again u use 0.1 second of hook time, and because of such small amount of space between hooks, almost everytime u can skip something, like this edge here

Part feels stairs-looking, so something block u on ur way, and again spacing issues

Fly is feeling hard here, not because it's actually hard, but because it's not comfortable to do

This definitely shouldn't be a faily part cuz: 1) It's moderate, c'mon, why u killing someone on moderates 2) It's the part u probably ain't gonna 1st try, cuz u have to hammer ur teammate while he is falling

And again, unfreezes wherever u can

Again spacing issues, so i kept bumping into this marked freeze and there is 2 ways next: 1) Or I am falling in deep and fail at all 2) Or my freezed teammate falling down and im failing and making part again

This catch and fly feels bad cuz of space issues, and setup itself

This part is hard also not cuz it's hard, but because u should make micro-hooks that feels awkward with a straight line of tp

Also try to make cp lines wherever and whenever it's possible as small as it can be or try to get rid of it at all, and make the gameplay cleaner

Also kinda awkward to get speed from ur teammate cuz the marked platform is 1 block up, than it should be

It's cool that u thought about ways to recover in a lot of places all over the map, it's actually good!

Also try to be more creative with design, the plain walls of single blocks looks very horrible and oldschool, no one with good-quality designs doing it nowadays

u can atleast make it like that

Or u can make some easy and fancy tiles by yourself, we have a tutorial how to make own tilesets on youtube

or u can ask someone else to share some cool assets with u, i don't think someone is gonna be actually that greedy to not to share with someone else if it's open to use(sometimes it's not, so u cant just steal every asset u liked, or atleast ask the owner of tileset throught dc/game if it watermarked)

Why undeep here, and also sometimes such tiles isn't marked in design, tho it should be

Such things also should be visible in both design and entities

Try to be more convinient with such places, we call it "corners", and it's just so bad too see(i saw u closed it in a lot of places, so mentioned it) U can also use tiles without such gaps, i can share some if u want, so u don't need to close them, cuz they don't exist(I don't love this tiles, but it's "lazy" way to have less problems)

Can't see why the turn off entities sign here, cuz basically nothing there in design, or maybe im blind

I thought I shared all feedback about gameplay part, so started to mention design-things but here it is, also spacing issue here, not really comfy to get ur deeped teammate into the drag

If you put your dummy in gap you will saw it

Such way to deep ur teammate also is lazy-lookin, but can't really say it's a problem, cuz a lot of mappers use it that way(just keep in mind someone can be deeped by mistake, so such open deep lines is kinda bad)

I also liked such shiny things in your design, i see you really tried to made cool map and cool things on your map

I don’t know IF you have seen my message in

but if you haven’t i mentioned i’ll change overal look of the map to some cool style

So yeah, it's pretty much it. Conclusion: some parts are actually not bad, and i found it fun, BUT! 1) Spacing issues, just a lotta small spaces that can block everyone(cuz it's not a 2p forced map, but it isn't capable for the t0 map at all), just like all over the map. 2) Oldschool looking parts(what do I mean is places where u use 0.5s of hook, rehook, again small timed hook, and again and again..) U should look at what do we release nowadays, pretty much 5-6 new moderate maps(if u interested to make moderate again in future) will contain everything u should know about what is cool and liked by players today. 3) Design(yeah someone can say it's not a problem, but it is, corners, unmarked things, generic common tiles etc.) all this things build an idea of ​​the map, and if it all looks old school, then it will be perceived in the old way. 4) Pretty simple ideas of the parts, u just drag, and drag again, and again, and we saw that already thousand times, we are trying to release the maps that contain anything new, and if it's not, then it's gonna be very long testing, or will be declined at all, so yeah - ideas is everything, or u can rethink the existing parts by your way and create from it lotta new parts. U did a very good rebuilding, i saw this map when it was first time uploaded and u improved a lot of aspects of mappping, so gotta u say u did a good job, but it's not the end.

Mention:

If u have some questions i will answer it

Finally, I have a question for moderators: why do you always reject maps when you know they can be simply improved? I know there is a channel for pending maps and you can't just post them there if the map has potential, I'm not talking about maps that are terrible or just don't fit the ddnet atmosphere.

So basically there's no specific plan for evaluating maps, so every tester approaches them differently. Some reject maps outright due to a large number of different errors in the map, or if the map would simply be easier to rebuild from scratch with the available feedback than to rebuild the parts themselves, that is gonna took a lot of time, and we are not sure will it be in future a good map, or no. I almost never reject maps outright, but rather provide feedback and give the mapper a chance to thoroughly think through and rework the errors. If, after several fixes, the mapper still leaves errors or creates even more, and I see that the mapper simply doesn't understand their mistakes, then I provide detailed feedback and reject the map, as I believe this is the best way to completely review your map and truly understand the errors at hand and how best to change and prevent them in the future. However, if the map truly has numerous errors, and this is a case where there is potential, but it would be easier to take the good parts of the map, insert them into a new one, and create a different, better map, then I reject it, what simply happened to this map. And yeah, that means i'd leave this map as is, and started to create a new one.

ive noticed that a map in waiting = it can be released with a few minor tweaks while a declined map = that it requires most things to be reworked making it a completely different map

Maybe you can make a separate chanel to map that have a potential and need to be reworked

i've changed some things i could but i'll change the rest later cuz it's so late and i need to sleep anyway thanks for your help

Okey Guys i need your help I was struggling with this map so much and my very first project of it was made almost one year ago, and I realise this map is such a failure for my waste so much time and mental health on it. I only need some suggestions from you if I should give up and delete it or try as much as I can to make this map perfect?

please dont stress yourself ^^

mapping is such a long process, many mappers spend months on their first released one!

even the most experienced mappers (Aoe, corneum, destoros) spend a super long time on their maps, consider

by Aoe which released a few monthss ago, it took YEARS! to make!

I know mr.melon but I really need to know if is there any point of continuing this map

there always is - but dont feel stressed about it :c

you're making this fun journey a trip to hell if you put your mental health at risk, trying to achieve perfection

i dont have the capacity right now to test it again, so i can't give you a proper answer :/

That’s ok the map is still not finished

i played mao when it was submitted, the ideas are good and if it was submitted 8y ago it would probably get released

but like feeedback above said you would need to change almost every part to polish and modernize the map

bc it doesnt measure up to moderates released in the last 6mo

i wouldn't think of it as giving up, no effort in the editor is wasted

every experience you have and decision you make shapes ur future creations

do u still plan on making maps after this one

I know I have now much more experience in doing maps but they still kinda suck

Besides all this pompous talk, I'd say it's best to stop working on this particular map; it's taking up too much of your time and energy, and I speak from similar experience. Make a different map. When you start a new map, you're starting with a clean slate, which can have a positive impact on the quality of your map because you're not limited by existing map parts or the existing design

Do you think I can add some of the parts from this one?

I'd say maybe this parts have a potential for me, and this parts I liked, but almost every one still kinda awkward to play or feels raw, so it's better to rethink them or use as inspiration and make different parts

Ok I’ll think about it

Any of the Moderator or Admin u can delete this chanel i woldn’t post there any news so whatever

It probably will just be archived

How long it will take to be archived?

like a few days after no message

Usually takes a month after getting evaluation from what i noticed

Już się nie gniewasz za tą mapkę?

ravillion reference

So can i use some Tiles by Bit or i should ask him/her for it?

as far as i know, bit's mapres are open to use, but it's better to ask

Do you know what is his/her discord name?

@ bit

Ok i'll try thanks