#Mycelium
"Mycelium" by Assa [Solo]
DDNet 08/14/2023 11:49 AM
@essigautomat

this is your map's testing channel! Post map updates here and remember to follow our mapper rules: https://ddnet.org/rules

essigautomat 08/14/2023 11:54 AM

Note for this map: This map uses tuning variables from DDNet 17.2, so make sure the server you are running this is is at least in this version

b0mf 08/14/2023 11:54 AM

I’ll test it for you soon ^^

b0mf 08/14/2023 11:54 AM

What difficulty do you think it is

essigautomat 08/14/2023 11:56 AM

this map is a showcase of a mechanic and in my test with friends it took about 15 to 20 minutes for players to find out how to finish (in one case it took 2 hours). The map is finishable in 1 minute, so 1 or maybe 2 stars difficulty

b0mf 08/14/2023 11:56 AM

1 or 2 stars oki

essigautomat 08/14/2023 2:59 PM

And your Client, too, since the bouncing has a working prediction since 17.2

essigautomat 08/14/2023 3:37 PM

After watching a few players play the map I would maybe increase the difficulty level xD

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:32 PM

The design idea is nice but i think a little too much the hookables look a little strange. This doesnt need achange in my opinion i think its fine just a little weird.

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:32 PM

personally i would just lower the detail of the entire map

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:34 PM

part 1: the idea here is really cool i think it feels a little weird but you can easily get used to it :D

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:35 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:36 PM

ill be honest ive no idea how part 2 is supposed to be done

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:36 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:36 PM

i did it by bouncing here repeatedly to get height but im assuming this is wrong

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:36 PM

if not maybe indicate this to the player better

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:37 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:37 PM

not sure what this section is for

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:37 PM

im assuming the idea is to conserve your speed which is pretty cool idea

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:37 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:38 PM

for part 3 i like the idea of the sticky sections to introduce them etc but to me it feels like theres no real gameplay and that it can all be skipped by holding d

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:38 PM

i may have been doing it wrong so if thats the case a video of completion would be really useful

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:39 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:39 PM

here i just got height and then went up

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:39 PM

idk if was correct

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:39 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:39 PM

this part is inconsistent but i like it

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:40 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:40 PM

you can completely skip all of this gameplay by just getting speed here to fin

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:40 PM

map feels fine for a 1 star if everything i did was correct only some design changes needed

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:40 PM

if what i did was incorrect map needs a big rework

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:40 PM

i finished it in abt 3mins on my first att

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:46 PM

ok i'll continue on bomf speech, for part 1 it's great and have many way, but the cheat that bomf show is to easy even if it's slower than real part, it have to be fix somehow

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:47 PM
  • a would like to see how you do every part, because i kinda feel like i was cheating some part ( i'll explain)
vena6080 08/14/2023 4:47 PM

this is good

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:49 PM

but here, is that how it's indeed for the speedrun? because i can't do it this way, i do a normal swing (wich have a realy bad flow cause of the amout of speed) if you can show a good way wich better flow

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:51 PM

here you can cheat just by jumping

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:52 PM

im assuming this is intentional i dont see another way to get up there

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:53 PM

youre supposed to jump around?

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:53 PM

here it's faster the red way

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:53 PM

map looks like you are supposed to go down

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:53 PM

yea i think so

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:54 PM

it kinda break the flow of the map, with the bounce it's better flow because it give the impression of never losing speed while racing

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:55 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 4:55 PM

maybe it would be better with a tune on this wall

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:55 PM

jump bounce of wall then left

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:57 PM

this break my brain at start but it's just a jump, idk what to think about it, kinda break the flow too, and the stopper is useless ( rules number one, try to not use to much entities, in this case the map is clean and no need stopper)

gazebr 08/14/2023 4:57 PM

how many parts did i do right? cuz i think i did half of the stuff incorrectly also a lot of the blocks arent used at all and only confuse you more

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:57 PM

the wall is to close for the jump, but if the platform is upper, the jump is not possible and the real part is clean

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:58 PM

hm

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:58 PM

this part is good

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:58 PM

i hope the way you did the first part is correct because it looks alot cooler :D

vena6080 08/14/2023 4:59 PM

final part lose all the flow of the map, going right just to swing / jump left to finish

gazebr 08/14/2023 4:59 PM

it looks cool but you have to do a random slowdown to hit the bounce below

gazebr 08/14/2023 4:59 PM

cant just drop as well

b0mf 08/14/2023 4:59 PM

maybe u got too much speed xd

gazebr 08/14/2023 5:00 PM

there is literally a swing at the start that gives massive speed, do i have to do the part worse to beat it? xD

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:01 PM

for the first part i do the same, but at start i was jumping from left to the the platform in the middle and it work too

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:01 PM

no

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:01 PM

i think theres just so many ways to do it

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:01 PM

difficult to balance

gazebr 08/14/2023 5:02 PM

great concept but right now the map is super short, a lot of the stuff seems to be cheesable, some blocks arent used which messes with players and there is little exploration of the mechanics these blocks provide (mainly just bonk -> go fast)

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:05 PM

i like the fact that some useless block are disturbing players, they will need to use brain. but for the exploration i'm not totally agree, i understand it's not only going fast, but some part have just a bad flow

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:05 PM

$waiting

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:05 PM

i think the blocker design should be changed also

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:05 PM

it looks a little weird to me

gazebr 08/14/2023 5:06 PM

if your puzzle needs random junk in the part to be hard to solve then its a bad puzzle

gazebr 08/14/2023 5:07 PM

+i think it will be hard enough even without junk just cuz the execution is difficult (if i did it correctly that is)

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:08 PM

depend how it's make, in this case i see some block that are use to fix cheat and creat fake way, that not just random place

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:09 PM

i think it can probably be fixed :D

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:09 PM

have faith

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:10 PM

btw what rating do you think it is ? it can't be 1*

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:10 PM

maybe 2*

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:10 PM

i think 1

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:12 PM

but it need precision on tee mouvement overall, little brain for people who don't know map, and debutant player will have hard time to understand the tunes mecanic, and in same time it's not failly and i'm not expect of solo map rating, i need more people

gazebr 08/14/2023 5:12 PM
b0mf 08/14/2023 5:13 PM

i think it can be either 1 or 2 maybe

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:13 PM

short map makes me think 1 more

gazebr 08/14/2023 5:17 PM

also sv_solo_server 1 ploz

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:17 PM

<3

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:17 PM

i was going to suggest but idk the command

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:52 PM

not like this xDD

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:52 PM

this section is a red hering, there are multiple ways the parts can be solved (which is intended)

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:53 PM

yes, a normal player would always jump there and notice "ah, I stick to it", yes you could skip it by holding d, that's why the second bump is bouncing you up, any better suggestion for introduction of the orange sticky tiles?

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:54 PM

depends on what you did on the previous part, if you do it right, you directly bounce on the ceiling (the ceiling under the hookable tiles)

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:54 PM

maybe use them in an ascending way use them to stick up or so

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:54 PM

would be cool

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:55 PM

it isn't, you just need good speed, this is just harder

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:55 PM

yes you can directly skip it, but this isn't faster! but finishing directly from below is the fastest way actually

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:56 PM

you can be much faster

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:56 PM

you did this part wrong.

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:56 PM

i agree :D

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:57 PM

you mean my way or the way i draw ?

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:57 PM

show me your way

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:58 PM

this is a skip and I know of this, it's intentional, the left part is just to make it easier for non-speedrunning players, I don't think a map needs to be linear!

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:58 PM

Can't follow you here (like at all?). Double jump with fullspeed into the right wall

vena6080 08/14/2023 5:58 PM

okok i don't have problem about little cheat, but the one in the first part is kinda big

b0mf 08/14/2023 5:59 PM

the first one needs a fix for sure

essigautomat 08/14/2023 5:59 PM

you did everything correctly there xD

vena6080 08/14/2023 6:00 PM

i was just saying i was doing shit, but it's fine

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:00 PM

I think the fact that it's cheesable and not linear, more like a puzzle map, is fun

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:01 PM

it's very close to the tile in the editor, what do you suggest?

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:02 PM

this strat is valid, but slow

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:02 PM

do I need to set this myself?

b0mf 08/14/2023 6:03 PM

it looks too pixel too me id suggest the

b0mf 08/14/2023 6:03 PM

these

b0mf 08/14/2023 6:03 PM
essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:04 PM

I can upload a demo with the intended and my speedrun strat (or both), do you want it/them? Tell me which

b0mf 08/14/2023 6:04 PM

id like both :D

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:04 PM

okay, give me a bit xD

b0mf 08/14/2023 6:05 PM

πŸ‘

vena6080 08/14/2023 6:12 PM

yes here in the editor

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:15 PM

intended strat:

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:21 PM

58.5 (managed 57.8 on testmap)

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:22 PM

you don't want to cut out every cut, there will always be one nobody thought of

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:22 PM

it's in the nature of bouncytiles

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:27 PM
@gazebr

i like your end strat!

you are missing 2 crucial bounces where you should use the bouncy tiles but stop (and then say the map is not smooth 😜 )

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:29 PM
essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:29 PM

Added the solo setting

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:30 PM

these are very similar to the arrow I used and animated

essigautomat 08/14/2023 6:32 PM

I hope you are having fun with the map ❀️

essigautomat 08/14/2023 7:07 PM

there is a low details button in the game and I tend to use it. I can't get rid of the roots in the ground, because they indicate bouncyness/stickyness

essigautomat 08/14/2023 7:08 PM

but I missed a few layers, thank you πŸ˜…

essigautomat 08/14/2023 7:16 PM

The purpose of this section is also to be able to mess around with the new tiles, this is a bit out of scope for this map. My strats don't show, that you can use this part, too, but you can use it when going to the right back as another wall you can bounce at

essigautomat 08/14/2023 7:20 PM

I don't get why the stopper is useless, the stopper indicates the exit, did you jump around the island on the right not using the stopper way? πŸ€”

essigautomat 08/14/2023 7:22 PM
  • moved more tile and quad layer into the details section
vena6080 08/14/2023 7:24 PM

it's ok, i just say the same thing to every mapper, specialy when they spam stopper/switch/speeder..

gazebr 08/14/2023 7:58 PM

Nah thats what Vena said

I only said that some solutions feel unintentional and some blocks have no purpose (seemingly or not), smoothness/flow is very low on my priority list xD

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:02 PM

okay sorry, I don't mean it like that πŸ™ˆ unintentional yes, that's the purpose of the map is showing how and where to use the bouncy tiles. Except for parts of the 1 tile bouncy room there is not much in the map that has no purpose at all. So how would you change the map or some parts? I already heard

  • change the sticky part introduction
  • change the end, so the direct strat isn't viable Any ideas how to implement these changes?
gazebr 08/14/2023 8:06 PM

It would be hard to change the start if you wanna keep the map super small but if you are willing to extend then some very basic parts would be nice (like a part about only getting hight from a bounce, etc.) For the end you can make it so all floor bouncy blocks have blocks above them (non bouncy) so you can only use them after gaining horizontal speed (so you dont bonk)

gazebr 08/14/2023 8:09 PM

1 example of "unused" tiles is this: from my testing there is absolutely no way you can clear that gap by djing into orange and gliding to the end so the only solution is to do a normal dj, so why is this stuff even there making it look possible when it isnt :P

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:10 PM

i tend to skip the bouncy ones on the left and use the orange ones above in my speedrun^

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:10 PM

so the only place where you don't need the ornage ones is in between the dj

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:11 PM

I wouldn't force the unsticking, since it's a mechanik I want to showcase

gazebr 08/14/2023 8:11 PM

Wait so you can actually clear it by sticking twice?

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:12 PM

see here, 40 secs

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:13 PM

I see, it's hard to see

essigautomat 08/14/2023 8:13 PM

but I promise at least sometimes I do, sometimes even thrice after the bounce

vena6080 08/23/2023 3:44 PM

i put it back to waiting, raison -> nothing have change, we mentioned many problems on the map

vena6080 08/23/2023 3:44 PM

$waiting

essigautomat 08/24/2023 6:14 PM

can you please summarize your problems with it? There were a few things other mentioned where I dissagree with, for example the one-way which is very close to the default one

louis.place 08/24/2023 7:42 PM

u should finish material layer and use it on this map πŸ˜…

coke1465 08/24/2023 7:45 PM

I played the map, first section feels a bit boring bcs 1000 ways to cheat it

coke1465 08/24/2023 7:46 PM

The last jumps in second section was way harder than all other parts

essigautomat 08/24/2023 9:12 PM

I think you mean the part with the orange, yes it's harder, I didn't find 100 ways to cheat the first part

Should I increase the platform to land on on the last part? What ideas do you have to fix the first part?

essigautomat 08/25/2023 8:55 AM

go check your github btw...

louis.place 08/25/2023 11:32 AM

oh xd

louis.place 08/25/2023 11:33 AM

i was viewing the videos above on mobile and thought you were using some other weird tune 😹

coke1465 08/25/2023 11:56 AM

hmmm not sure xd

essigautomat 08/27/2023 9:26 AM

First I will update the end jump, I make the plattform 2 or 3 blocks longer (to the right), but I need some time

fjp123 09/06/2023 1:28 AM

very unique map, I enjoyed

texnonik 09/06/2023 9:20 AM

I would say unique idea . If there could be done somethink more interesting , than i would say that to (if there any possibility to create )

fjp123 09/07/2023 2:43 AM

yeah that's true to an extent ig

essigautomat 09/11/2023 7:17 PM
  • made the end jump 3 blocks shorter in order to make it easier and be more in line with the difficulty of the rest of the map
essigautomat 09/11/2023 7:18 PM

I like the puzzly nature of the start and don't know how to adress the "shortcut" issues, even the end is shortcuttable, but imo that's not a problem, this is a fun map not a tryhard map. You can still tryhard it, nobody came close to my time, so I challange you all.

b0mf 10/05/2023 11:17 AM

Any more updates on this map?

essigautomat 10/06/2023 1:42 PM
@b0mf

can you give me a precise list of things you are missing right now? you wrote a lot in your previous answers and it's hard to keep up with all the suggestions, but here is a list of things you mentioned which I (at least) thought about:

  • shortcuts: as I mentioned I don't really care, this map is a bit cryptic in nature, and the parts feel like puzzles, maybe I should just make it longer. Also the (bouncing) skip for the first part isn't that obvious nor easy
  • the oneway: Yes, there is a rule about oneways and not overusing them, I used one and it's a nice addition to the gameplay there, ironically just to prevent a shortcut, that would be very anyoing
  • the oneway design: it's very similar to one of the mapres you send, also similar to the entities in the editor, I don't understand your problem with it
  • sticky tiles: "maybe use them in an ascending way use them to stick up or so". Unfortunately this is not how the sticky tiles work. The force which you are throwing yourself against the tiles matters for the time you stick on the ceiling. So just touching this is not enough. This is an implementation limitation, not a mapping one.
  • too much details: there is a lower details option in the game and this is mapped, use it if you think the map is overdetailed. IMO a lot of ddnet maps are UNDERDETAILED which upsets me a lot, you can do so much in the editor, give details more love.
  • part 3 holding d (after the ceiling): if you just want to pass this part, you can do it like this, wouldn't be any optimal, would require maybe one or two double jumps in the up-chute. You can gain much more speed there

I still appretiate your feedback, can you maybe map your changes/ideas of parts (just gametiles is enough)? That way we all could test them, maybe you see something obvious that I am missing.

essigautomat 10/06/2023 1:42 PM

Lastly I posted a playthrough of the intended and the cutted way, which you didn't react to.

It's hard to make a map with boucing/energy-convering tiles without skips, because they don't introduce a penalty. On the otherhand not bouncing can lead to huge penalties and timelosses, needing 20 seconds to regain your momentum. Also I didn't use any teleports, just deathtiles in the beginning.

essigautomat 10/06/2023 1:43 PM

(Today I found out that discord has a character limit, lol sorry)

b0mf 10/07/2023 11:04 AM

I will do this once I’m back at my house on Monday

comebackplay 11/10/2023 6:06 AM

Here i play first part and i like idea but its mapped so annoying and i dont wanna continue test. 1 tiny swing with no reason. why just no give player full control? 2 1 tile hole, this is not hard its annoying, better do 2 hole tile. 3 here new mechanic u need bounce on ground any new player will fail that 100% because on ground harder bounce then on air and keep speed. When u add smth new u need teach ppl how it pass. IT's mean new and hard stuff need be closer to cp or spawn. 4 here u need so much action in small area. Normal ppl have 200-300 ms to react , but here u need less and its impossible u need do it longer and less annoying. and main reason why i don’t like this place bcs i dont get satisfaction cus its boring skill required and i fell it can be mapped better

b0mf 11/10/2023 3:31 PM

(He forgot)

comebackplay 11/11/2023 12:40 PM

Oh man ur so aggressive I don’t wanna talk with u anymore

essigautomat 11/11/2023 8:19 PM

I am so tired of teeworlds, I don't want to work on this map anymore. This was just a little showcase for a new mechanic I implemented for ddnet, but I guess other mappers have to find out

essigautomat 11/11/2023 8:19 PM

$decline

DDNet 11/11/2023 8:19 PM

Command not found!

essigautomat 11/12/2023 10:08 AM

apologized to triki in pms

texnonik 11/12/2023 10:42 AM

well i found it , because i was wondering how did you made it :/ i have found glitch with mehanic but i don't think it's could be good part . actually i just thinked to make novice map where you go right fall in bounce and go up right . simple part but need to make somethink more then only that

essigautomat 11/12/2023 10:45 AM

What bug did you find?

essigautomat 11/12/2023 10:45 AM
@texnonik
texnonik 11/12/2023 10:50 AM

if you hook and hold hook , you touch wall you go slowly down , like speedup , but with different configuration of course

essigautomat 11/12/2023 10:54 AM

can you make a clip? You mean you slow down right?

texnonik 11/12/2023 11:22 AM

i don't remember name witch i had / or i deleted it

comebackplay 11/12/2023 2:52 PM
  • rep
vena6080 01/15/2024 10:52 PM

$decline

ninjed 01/19/2024 12:31 PM

sadly, was a good map