00:41 < bridge> <gorp_tw> https://github.com/swarfeya/teeworlds-library-ts/pull/14 finally, i actually did a teeworlds thing, with help from furo
00:48 < bridge> <gorp_tw> ah, forgot to update docs
00:49 < bridge> <gorp_tw> mh, and maybe should have passed all 128 even if they're unused on ddnet currently
00:55 < bridge> <b lazu wjelgook.i> gud morning fellow ddevs
09:09 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** @milkeeycat aaaaaaaaaaaa
09:09 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** i feel like headers is such a dance
09:10 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** if you have one huge header it works, if you have lots of tiny headers it works too. But as soon as you have a few bigger headers it becomes such a struggle
09:30 < bridge> <milkeeycat> chillerdragon
09:30 < bridge> <milkeeycat> > ono message.h uses the chunk data type so this also errors.
09:30 < bridge> <milkeeycat> 
09:30 < bridge> <milkeeycat> Idk why but I remember trying and it was compiling fine for me :\
09:30 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** lol wut
09:30 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** chunk.h has so much message stuff it should be basically message.h xd
09:31 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** but message.h uses the chunk datatype so it has to include it
09:31 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** here https://github.com/MilkeeyCat/ddnet_protocol/blob/2e51204054f09e159b4db054f16f87f4d425e526/include/ddnet_protocol/message.h#L76
09:31 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** message.h uses `DDNetChunk`
09:31 < bridge> <milkeeycat> ye, and it should be fine
09:31 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** but chunk uses MessageKindId
09:31 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** https://github.com/MilkeeyCat/ddnet_protocol/blob/2e51204054f09e159b4db054f16f87f4d425e526/include/ddnet_protocol/chunk.h#L155-L167
09:32 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** MessageKind*
09:32 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** the chunk holds a message so it needs to know the message type
09:32 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** so the message kind enum has to be accessible to chunk.h
09:33 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** i will continue with actual snap code now -.- already wasted 30 mins on this 
09:34 < bridge> <milkeeycat> `DDNetMessageKind` was originally defined in `chunk.h`, not `message.h`
09:35 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** yes
09:35 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** because it needs it
09:35 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** so moving it to message.h breaks
09:35 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** so the thing that would work is moving the packer init to chunk.h i did that now
09:36 < bridge> <milkeeycat> I said to only move `ddnet_packer_init_msg`, no?
09:36 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** but i still think best would be to leave it all in packer.h
09:36 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** u said to move it to message.h
09:36 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** wait that should work now that i think about it xd
09:37 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** because message includes chunk and it has it then
09:37 < bridge> <milkeeycat> yes -.-
09:37 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** i feel like i moved the wrong enum
09:38 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** yup i did xd
09:38 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** thanks :D
09:38 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** what about the name tho?
09:38 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** i still like to keep `ddnet_packer_init_msg`
09:39 < bridge> <milkeeycat> ye we can keep it, I still think it makes sense that it's not in `packer.h` because it's not "core functionality" of packer to work with message kinds. It's message related and it can define its own functions which work with packer.
09:39 < bridge> <milkeeycat> or maybe I drank too much stupid juice :\
09:40 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** yea i guess it makes sense
09:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** @milkeeycat whats you take on unknown snap items?
09:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** in my libs i usually store their entire payload
09:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** so one can for example build a proxy and alter known snap items and pass on unknown snap items correctly
09:42 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** teeworlds just skips over unknown snap items
09:42 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** if we decide to store their data without knowing what it is to support any kind of future ddnet ex snap item in a proxy that repacks the snap we would have to think about memory
09:43 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** because the size is not known and snap items dont have a max payload size as far as i know so stack allocating doesnt really work. Which means we would need to do a heap allocation for EVERY unknown snap item
09:43 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** idk i feel like this entire lib will be a slow bloat already because of how many heap allocations it needs to do to parse a single packet
09:46 < bridge> <milkeeycat> how many heap allocations is a slow bloat? xd
09:47 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** well i would say it starts from 1 per packet :D 
09:47 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** and we do like a gazillion already
09:47 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** or like 2 xd
09:47 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** huffman decompressed payload and chunks
09:48 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** but now doing it for MULTIPLE chunks would be a whole different level
09:55 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** oh wait we dont need to malloc 
09:55 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** we can just point into the payload
09:55 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** all good
11:38 < bridge> <Assa> Gumo, have some nice holidays devs 🙂
11:38 < bridge> <louis> merry crimmas
11:39 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** fck christmas
11:39 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** fakin relgious cult x coca cola ad bs
11:40 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** horrible music, horrible decoration and horrible vibes
11:40 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** christmas should be banned
11:40 < bridge> <sqwinix> Hey guys, first off, Merry Christmas. Secondly, just theoretically, how difficult would it be to add voice chat to the game? I know there are a lot of subtleties, but I'm just curious about your opinions.
11:40 < bridge> <DDNet> Hellou :3
11:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** @sqwinix its in ddnet-rs i think
11:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** just uninstall your c++ client
11:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** nobody plays minecraft bedrock
11:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** why play ddnet bedrock
11:41 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/issues/6547
11:42 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** ddnet wont be adding voice chat
11:43 < bridge> <sqwinix> Ok, thanks
11:48 < bridge> <Assa> xD there are too many people just hallucinating and vibe-explaining the universe
11:49 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** @Assa hm?
11:49 < bridge> <Assa> but on the other hand, having some time with your familiy can also be nice
11:49 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** family time during christmas is the worst kind of family time
11:54 < bridge> <pioooooo> Welcome to China we banned Christmas
11:59 < bridge> <tsfreddie> Can confirm
12:00 < bridge> <Assa> Idk, different cultures I guess, do you have a religion that china follows or is it like meh for all of them?
12:00 < bridge> <tsfreddie> We have a teacher in our family and they were given instructions to stop students from celebrating Christmas
12:00 < bridge> <tsfreddie> we don't anymore i think. at least for regular hans.
12:01 < bridge> <iinventedyou> hello my name is  ddnet player but ı banned vpn ı musnt  off vpn how off vpn
12:02 < bridge> <tsfreddie> https://ddnet.org/vpn/
12:02 < bridge> <iinventedyou> thank you so much bro
12:03 < bridge> <tsfreddie> basically check if you have any network programs open. if not then you can #✉-create-a-ticket and use the ban appeal and they might help you there
12:06 < bridge> <Assa> We had an outright ban back then in the DDR, but it was like really forbidden and you needed to hide in order to celebrate your regiligios events. It had the opposite effect of people becoming more religions as rebellion against the state. As far as I read china didn't outright ban the celebration with your familiy at home
12:06 < bridge> <louis> wow rly?
12:06 < bridge> <tsfreddie> Ye you can do whatever you like at home or in your company as long as you are not disturbing other people. it's not like police will bust down your place cuz you've setup a tree.
12:07 < bridge> <learath2> Not too difficult, mostly very costly and extremely horrible for moderation
12:07 < bridge> <tsfreddie> It's just banned in any official setting and disencouraged in commercial settings
12:08 < bridge> <tsfreddie> I think the higher up order is just to discourage it but local gov over enforce stuff since the order are vague. that's just how china works.
12:08 < bridge> <louis> are there many religious ppl in china
12:08 < bridge> <tsfreddie> not really
12:08 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** @Assa oldge ddr story teller
12:09 < bridge> <tsfreddie> also i guess depends on which part. i'm sure there are ethnicity minorty groups that have higher chirstians percentages
12:09 < ws-client> **<ChillerDragon>** also the term "DDR" is ambigious in the ddnet #developer channel
12:09 < bridge> <Assa> I am a western german, my knowledge is fairly limited on **that** topic ...
12:11 < bridge> <Assa> I wasn't even alive during the "Mauerfall", this was around 37 years ago already
12:12 < bridge> <learath2> Being anti-religion is communism 101 anyway
12:12 < bridge> <tsfreddie> ~~:PepePopcorn: communism is a religion~~
12:13 < bridge> <tsfreddie> obligatory #off-topic as a blue name
12:13 < bridge> <learath2> That is kind of sort of the idea, you want to replace religion with dialectical materialism
12:14 < bridge> <Assa> I replaced it by optimitistic nihilism :justatest:
12:15 < bridge> <learath2> lol, I thought this was #off-topic with how offtopic this entire convo was
12:15 < bridge> <tsfreddie> mb
12:16 < bridge> <Assa> can't even wish ppl nice holidays without causing offtopic :kek:
12:17 < bridge> <chillerdragon> Wishing nice holiday is off topic
12:17 < bridge> <chillerdragon> Same as „good morning“
12:18 < bridge> <remakepower> I don't think so, lol
12:19 < bridge> <tsfreddie> our apartment did setup a light up christmas tree
12:19 < bridge> <Assa> Waiting for the police to storm your house /s
12:20 < bridge> <tsfreddie> the estate company did it, please arrest them and lower our fees lol
12:21 < bridge> <remakepower> so I wonder why 0.7 use a extra texture for Christmas hat. Could we add something like that? Though we have already had `santa_` skins.
12:22 < bridge> <Assa> I guess this allows for cusomizing the santa head for differently styled skins
12:22 < bridge> <Assa> but - I agree - we could add a lot of hats
12:23 < bridge> <tsfreddie> and we have OCD people insist that every skin combination should look good so the 0.7 skin system was not really popular to begin with (among these people)
12:24 < bridge> <Assa> whatever you do, sb is complaining in ddnet
12:24 < bridge> <remakepower> Yeah you're right
12:24 < bridge> <tsfreddie> iirc there was a convo like 5 years ago about banning conflicting colors in the picker
12:24 < bridge> <tsfreddie> it is stupid
12:25 < bridge> <remakepower> I have to say that it looks like not really nice.
12:26 < bridge> <remakepower> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/293493549758939136/1453710363177648149/image.png?ex=694e70c7&is=694d1f47&hm=1000132df9537a8a31d052cbf153ed42aa1e3f935a0ee69340ec4f5289e86544&
12:27 < bridge> <remakepower> Really small.
12:28 < bridge> <remakepower> Didn't it?
12:28 < bridge> <Assa> wdym?
12:29 < bridge> <remakepower> I just thought that the 0.7 Xmas hat looks weird.
12:43 < bridge> <melon> aww #11318 broke our internal parser :KEKW: 
12:43 < bridge> <melon> Merry christmas to everyone celebrating
12:43 < bridge> <DDNet> https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/pull/11318
12:50 < bridge> <Assa> should be an easy parser fix 😉
12:51 < bridge> <melon> ye, just a slight annoyance because we only noticed it when the servers restarted which took a while :kekw:
12:53 < bridge> <Assa> do we need a PR: Changes log parsing label? :kek:
12:53 < bridge> <Assa> nah doesn't make sense for new messages anyway
12:54 < bridge> <melon> you'd theoretically have to slap that on anything strings/formatting :kekw:
15:21 < bridge> <Assa> why is the scoreboard title showing the time of a player if I spectate them, but only if it's not a timescore, but a normal score
15:24 < bridge> <Assa> why is the scoreboard title showing the score of a player if I spectate them, but only if it's not a timescore, but a normal score
16:53 < bridge> <Assa> I mean this https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/blob/master/src%2Fgame%2Fclient%2Fcomponents%2Fscoreboard.cpp#L181
16:53 < bridge> <Assa> @robyt3 do you have an idea?
18:06 < bridge> <louis> how does vital netmsg flag work?
18:13 < bridge> <Assa> Except for preinputs, clients just ignore messages without this flag :pepeW:
18:16 < bridge> <qxdfox> and the server?
18:18 < furo> @louis The vital flag will include a sequence number to the packet chunk. The sequence number is incremented for every vital msg. The sender adds the vital msg to its resend backlog. The reciever will increment its ack number for every vital msg and if the msg sequence differs from ack. The reciever will request a resend of the senders backlog and reset its ack to the msg's sequence.
18:19 < furo> Not really a complete answer, and may be slightly incorrect. but should hopefully explain the idea at least.
18:22 < bridge> <louis> ty
18:29 < bridge> <melon> i thought vital just resends? - does the client seriously drop all non-vital msgs?, i feel like i'm missing some code lore here
18:31 < bridge> <robyt3> The client drops game (non-system) messages that are not vital because all game messages are expected to be vital (except preinput)
18:32 < bridge> <robyt3> I don't know. Seems like the server record is rendered when timescore is enabled.
18:45 < bridge> <alw5> why are demos 25 tps?
18:47 < bridge> <teero777> @milkeeycat what do you think about my commit 🗣️ (i uploaded test data)
18:47 < bridge> <teero777> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/293493549758939136/1353804416200872036/image.png?ex=694e315d&is=694cdfdd&hm=4a52975239447b95d9e81201bf85ade0c88617966cd1c5f93f13daf30a910262&
18:48 < furo> @alw5 Because clients are only sent 25 snapshots a second by default. Could be changed on the server with `sv_high_bandwidth 1`
18:48 < bridge> <alw5> a okay
18:49 < bridge> <alw5> how do race times have 0.02 then?
18:50 < furo> The server is still running at 50 ticks a second, but the client only recieves data at half the rate.
19:03 < bridge> <gorp> @sqwinix Mumble voice chat is in CMClient (TClient fork) but when we have time it will be merged into TClient. You just join any Mumble server with the plugin installed on your client and it will work. It also does proximity chat volume changes by default.
19:05 < bridge> <gorp> Not a perfect solution, since you would need to only join one channel per server, but works good enough for events probably
19:07 < bridge> <gorp> We might be able to have it send the server IP as well, and mute people not on your server, or maybe the Mumble plugin already handles this, idk
19:13 < bridge> <gorp> Also, in Volleybot-related news, the basic win reporting and stats system are now finished. But I'm having a time complying with rate limit / chat points without somehow losing whispers still? Maybe that's just life and the way the networking stack works with sv\_chat but I'm at least never muted by the server now
19:17 < bridge> <alw5> yeah sometimes ur messages just dont get sent
19:17 < bridge> <gorp> It's really weird, I asked in here if they are not vital (assume so now) but I'll have to look into tracking the delivery
19:19 < bridge> <gorp> I could try inflating the rate limit timeout so that it's super guaranteed to not hit it (right now it's (31 + Len) / 32 exactly)
19:19 < bridge> <gorp> But idk how that's still beating the server. with network lag and runtime execution loop
19:21 < furo> Chat messages are vital, but they will get silently dropped if you excedd the rate limit.
19:29 < bridge> <gorp_tw> ah okay good, so i must just be getting limited still. its possible my math is wrong, or """javascript"""
19:39 < bridge> <gorp_tw> ```js
19:39 < bridge> <gorp_tw> if (client.chat_queue.head !== null && client.chat_points >= CHAT_POINTS_PENALTY) {
19:39 < bridge> <gorp_tw>   const time = Date.now()
19:39 < bridge> <gorp_tw>   if (time > client.chat_time) {
19:39 < bridge> <gorp_tw>     const message = client.chat_queue.pop()
19:39 < bridge> <gorp_tw>     client.chat_time = time + ((31 + message.length) / 32)
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw>     client.chat_points -= CHAT_POINTS_PENALTY
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw>     client.game.Say(message)
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw>   }
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw> }
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw> ```
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw> I even added some sanity parens because i dont trust js
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw> (and yes i know my chat points implementation is not canonical, i guess it goes backwards technically)
19:40 < bridge> <gorp_tw> (and yes i know my chat points implementation is not canonical, i guess it recovers backwards technically)
19:46 < bridge> <gorp_tw> probably i need to refactor this out of on_snapshot and use async/await, or maybe measure time by getting the ticks out of snapshots (apparently not obvious to me how to do that)
20:14 < bridge> <teero777> btw why is there a stack limit?
20:54 < bridge> <sqwinix> wow, this is great
21:44 < bridge> <chillerdragon> @robyt3: huge android maintainer o0
21:44 < bridge> <chillerdragon> Not that it matters much but I wouldn’t call apple macOS Darwin
21:44 < bridge> <chillerdragon> It’s so legacy
21:49 < bridge> <chillerdragon> I wish we had an iOS maintainer as dedicated as robsi for android
21:50 < bridge> <chillerdragon> Just this morning I was approached in a cafe by someone who wanted to install the game on ios
21:57 < bridge> <robyt3> I just called it darwin because Google also does in the Android NDK filenames
22:01 < bridge> <robyt3> You need macOS to develop for iOS so it seems impossible to maintain without getting an Apple device.
22:03 < bridge> <teero777> chiller aren't you iphone fan?
22:04 < bridge> <teero777> or it was meskalin
22:04 < bridge> <teero777> i always confuse you two
23:11 < bridge> <Ewan Green> unique servers are back in usa
23:12 < bridge> <Ewan Green> merry christmas
23:12 < bridge> <Ewan Green> go race