00:00 <+bridge_> [ddnet] What an absolute joke... I'm still waiting on which country you want the lawyer in 00:00 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Or do I need to get one in every country? 00:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] would germany suffice for you? 00:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] given that this is where we're from? 00:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I'd say we should get licenses for the tilemaps we can too, but seeing how you react to the maps, I'm scared to even propose that 00:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yea get the lawyer 00:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ask if its legal to license maps that contain other tilesets or parts of other maps that dont have compatible licenses 00:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] is germany fine? 00:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] y 00:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Imagine spending money because jao decided this is a great hill to die on 00:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] jao why do you want a lawyer, you dont have liability in this 00:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 🤡 00:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] only deen probs 00:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] just stop this ridiculous hate towards heinrich 00:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u are the ones who dont want to accept it lol 00:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] licensing maps is common sense, the CC-BY licenses are human readable, they are project made for this 00:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so stop this bullshit 00:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > [1:04 AM] jao: u are the ones who dont want to accept it lol 00:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] The fact that you unanimously decided this is a bad idea? 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 how can you allow 1 admin to gatekeep something so important 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so u think its normal to start a discussion again and again after its done because the result isnt ur opinion? 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] "its done"? whats done 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] if its so important why has no one cared about it for 7 years 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Result? What result @jao ? Everytime you swoop in and say we aren't lawyers and say discussion is over 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] if its so important why dont u license old maps or remove them 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] because we werent on a platform such as steam were there can be legal issues 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] that argument is hypocritical 00:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] its common sense 00:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] What discussion even, it's only us trying to appease you, for hours at end and you just saying no 00:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 the result was that u couldnt answer my questions and stopped responding 00:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] why do we even try to appease him? just lets do it 00:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] the thing is steam cares about licenses and maps that ddnet releases as official are ddnet's responsibility 00:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this guy is to ego to accept anything right now 00:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] if steam cares about licenses then u have to only allow ddnet servers for steam client 00:07 <+bridge_> [ddnet] otherwise any random server can put illegal maps up 00:07 <+bridge_> [ddnet] omg 00:07 <+bridge_> [ddnet] We are responsible for what we publish 00:07 <+bridge_> [ddnet] What some random server publishes isn't our concern 00:07 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we dont ship ddnet servers with the configuration of ddracenetwork, we ship only a server and client executable along with some skins 00:07 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u ship ddnet client to steam 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] not our ddnet srv 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] tell us 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] whats so wrong 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] about licensing the map 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] go ahead 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this is ridiculous 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] It's not worse than what we have right now 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ive said my opinion last time already 00:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] the map licensing is not directly related to steam (except for the two maps we ship with the client) 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] tell me 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i dont remember it 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] go 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] whats an illegal map 👀 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yes 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i agree that u have to license the maps in the client 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we can license the maps on released on ddnet too 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] there is no pejorative 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] you can do anything 00:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] but u dont have to 00:10 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and its not important af like u make it look like 00:10 <+bridge_> [ddnet] your mindset is the one i hate most 00:10 <+bridge_> [ddnet] stall in ur life 00:10 <+bridge_> [ddnet] it's important for some people 00:10 <+bridge_> [ddnet] just because u dont care 00:10 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ur just ego 00:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] if its so important then why havent u done it 7 years ago 00:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ur ego 00:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] BECAUSE WE DIDN'T THINK ABOUT IT 00:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this excuse 00:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] why didnt u think about it 00:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Because most of us aren't 17yo anymore 00:12 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Hi im too dumb to decide 00:12 <+bridge_> [ddnet] projects grow 00:12 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I kind of laugh at how 4 ppl have to explain to one guy why this is important, like explaining it to him even matters 00:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Soreu it kinda does when he can just stop us from doing it 00:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] it wasn't done 7 years ago because ddnet wasn't going on steam 7 years ago 00:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] if he wasnt in care of map testing i would just make him go 00:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we should probs search someone else 00:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] put someone else for map testing 00:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] one of the testers 00:14 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 how he can stop you, if you are responsible for the code, servers, and so on. Unless I'm missing some point that he has legal rights to block everything due to getting console rights on the servers 00:14 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I'll just go to sleep, tired of arguing. I'll try contacting a german lawyer that specialises in copyright law tomorrow and hope he'll give me a discount 00:14 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and that 00:14 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > if its so important then why havent u done it 7 years ago 00:14 <+bridge_> [ddnet] dumbest argument ever 00:14 <+bridge_> [ddnet] he's an admin and we don't want to push forward for something that someone disagrees with so vehemently 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] my take 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Either way, you ain't forcing anyone to add the licenses. You are ASKING to do so 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and ur argument to remove me because i disagree with u is good? XD 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] what about respecting someones opinion 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] says you 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] who just because someone says x u directly disagree 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Soreu we work as a team, can't really go ahead when people are objecting as it takes all of us to run this thing 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i gave u arguments for my opinion 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u still havent provided proper arguments 00:15 * fstd senses drama 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Respecting someone's opinion is one thing, being completely close-minded about specific subjects is another, when you don't even get the arguments presented by others 00:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] if i think those arguments make sense, whats wrong about it? 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] tell me your arguments 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] So did we, which you dismissed the entirety of because we aren't lawyers 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] im not completely close minded 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] tell me your arguments 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] why do u want to force me to change my opinion 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u want to change my opinion based on what u believe 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i want the same 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] tell me your arguments 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> > big discussion incoming 00:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @ᶰ°Konͧsti 00:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so thats it 00:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @Learath2 00:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] no arguments at all 00:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> sry that ping was accidently Learath xd 00:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this is a community driven project, you can't be here without wanting to even bend over a bit for others 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > [1:11 AM] jao: if its so important then why havent u done it 7 years ago 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this is a recurring one 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > [1:05 AM] jao: if its so important why dont u license old maps or remove them 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this is another one 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > [12:51 AM] jao: if law was so easy there wouldnt be need for lawyers 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this is the last one I remember 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I'd go get popcorn, but it's tiring to even read all that so ima just go play something until the senseless discussion of not adding licenses is hopefully over... 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] why not bend for me 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] when did u ever bend for someone 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i bended for ddnet lot of times 00:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] specially coding 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i remember last time when u talked shit about lady saavik when she didnt like a thing in ur feature 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] honestly this disgusts me that 1 person can do this 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] where did u bend then 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i bended by adding options 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u make it personal because i dont agree 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] because U AIN'T BENDING, when other members of your admin team wants same thing and you're the one that doesn't agree with them. You do have your point, ok, but in this case and bending it should be done towards majority >.> 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @jao didn't he completely abandon it because you and saavik didn't like it? 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] to make it like how she wanted 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> i think that the decision is headed to jao cuz hes a responsible admin and also responsible for the complete map testing xd 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] dont give me bullshit 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and he added like 5 options before giving up 😛 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yeah 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 1 feature 00:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] was completly abandoned 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] showing weapons when frozen 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> good feature 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] such a crazy feature 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] xD 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @ᶰ°Konͧsti jao gatekeeped it 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] wtf why was it not added 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so his bending is insulting others and then abonding it 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] see 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] also he bended af to also include suggestions by me, even though he thought these were totally useless ones (and later community decided even further ones) 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i knew it was a good feature 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> > wtf why was it not added 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @plsplsplslol 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so that's not going to get added @Ryozuki ? 00:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ...but i'm out, gn & have fun 00:21 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Ravie jao and saavik were crazy about it not being added 00:21 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> actually just know the weapon numbers ez 00:21 <+bridge_> [ddnet] well I had my own idea for it but I can respect that the person actually making it wants it a different way 00:21 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/pull/2307 00:21 <+bridge_> [ddnet] here is how it looked 00:22 <+bridge_> [ddnet] look the amount of options 00:22 <+bridge_> [ddnet] disabling ninja particles would actually be sick 00:22 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and hiding the sword 00:22 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> HMM 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] back to map licensing 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we should do it 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> show ninja skin and real weapon 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 map releases are handled with django? 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we can just force it there 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] you can disable ninja particles thru image editing but it makes some maps unplayable 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and announce it 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Ryozuki it's trivial to implement it 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] not going forward with it before we all reach an agreement though 00:23 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so he will gatekeep this forever with his only argument being "if its so important why..." 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] im done 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i go watch anime 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] have fun 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Neither will anyone else, no one wants to be the one that kills ddnet 😛 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> lmfao these huge trolls reacting on a nouis message 00:24 <+fstd> rip ddnet 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Im not a troll 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Hey maybe deen will make an executive decision to nuke ddnet 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u reacted too 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> U 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 he did that 00:24 <+bridge_> [ddnet] idk if u were here 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I was, more lurking back then though 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] wait deen is the head honcho right 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> deen is the best thing ever happened to tw 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ye without deen we would have nothing at all 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @ᶰ°Konͧsti plsnomorereactionspam 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> wat 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 u can disable external emojis 00:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 no more trolls 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] it's making my script have a seizure 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Im only reacting one single time 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i think ddnet should become a public company 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Its plsplsplstroll 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] no u 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] what script 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ddracenetwork is not trademarked, someone could steal the name ez 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @onby some statistics thing I'm trying out 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] is it open src 00:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> onby is ur gores Assistent tool os? 00:27 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Ryozuki File trademark in Catalonia 00:27 <+bridge_> [ddnet] no 00:27 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> can u make? 00:27 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @onby nope, it's just an experiment 00:28 <+bridge_> [ddnet] what does it do 00:28 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Training a neural network to act like the average ddnet discord member 00:28 <+bridge_> [ddnet] hahaha 00:28 <+bridge_> [ddnet] so why is reaction spam bad :troll: 00:28 <+bridge_> [ddnet] It always wants to say :justatest: for some reason though 00:29 <+bridge_> [ddnet] because` :justatest: ` 00:29 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I think I have a bug somewhere 😄 00:29 <+bridge_> [ddnet] when ur finished u should make it into an account and nobody will notice 00:29 <+bridge_> [ddnet] maybe the account name is louis and its been an ongoing experiment 00:30 <+bridge_> [ddnet] :justatest: 00:30 <+bridge_> [ddnet] :justatest: 00:30 <+bridge_> [ddnet] no its probably cellegen 00:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] hey @Ravie, while you're here btw 00:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> can u give license? 00:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> :troll: 00:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] quite a few skins in the ddnet client are from you 00:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] (15) 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @heinrich5991 how many by Whis? 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 30 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> lmao 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @ᶰ°Konͧsti ur license 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/293493549758939136/734175745039007804/license_konsti.txt 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Is he r1? 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yes 00:32 <+bridge_> [ddnet] check out https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/issues/2518 @ᶰ°Konͧsti 00:33 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Ravie did you already make your mind up whether and how you'd license your skins? 00:33 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> I ask Whis for license but hes gone sleep 1h ago 00:33 <+bridge_> [ddnet] thanks @ᶰ°Konͧsti 00:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] those old cat skins are terrible but I think saying to remove them would be selfish, I don't really care what happens with them 00:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] aoe skins were famous back then, but nowadays i dont see ppl with them 00:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Sleep is for the weaks 00:35 <+bridge_> [ddnet] isn't it like afternoon where you live 00:35 <+bridge_> [ddnet] indeed 00:35 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 18:35 00:36 <+bridge_> [ddnet] but im awake at 2am too :justatest: 00:36 <+bridge_> [ddnet] they removed aoe Skins from ddnet 00:36 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Right? 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/293493549758939136/734177203423805480/image0.png 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] wtf is with these names 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @louis aoe made personal skins 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 00 is a dirty trick 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] to list them first 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] on he client 00:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] the* 00:40 <+bridge_> [ddnet] its so bloat 00:40 <+bridge_> [ddnet] should change name or remove 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] those aren't in the client 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> can we add bot skin by @eNJi to default skins? 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yea but having it in database is stupid 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] like you 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] whos gonna use a skin with someone elses name on it 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] u 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> nouis new player, doesnt know bandana times 00:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> :feelsbadman: 00:42 <+bridge_> [ddnet] banana times 00:42 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> aMu legend 00:42 <+bridge_> [ddnet] konsti legend 00:42 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @eNJi gib skin license so @heinrich5991 add it to default DDNet client :feelsamazingman: 00:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] my body belongs to him 00:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> https://forum.ddnet.tw/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=6772 00:44 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> 00:44 <+bridge_> [ddnet] what if the 🤖 emoji is copyrighted 00:45 <+bridge_> [ddnet] invert colours :monkaS: 00:46 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> what if Ravie is right :MonkaS: 00:46 <+bridge_> [ddnet] what about gB times? 00:47 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> What about donating for the bestest mom in the world 00:47 <+bridge_> [ddnet] True 00:47 <+bridge_> [ddnet] they're open source :0 00:48 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> did she get problems during corona? I mean could u still pay it 00:48 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @Pepe 00:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] theres no copyright on that skin i didnt even put my name in the corner, so its by anonymous :kek: 00:50 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://twemoji.twitter.com/ 00:50 <+bridge_> [ddnet] you just need to put a mention 00:50 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> so Syltoox png is os? 00:50 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yes :poggers: 00:50 <+bridge_> [ddnet] as long as he adds credit 00:51 <+bridge_> [ddnet] also it was made on cracked photoshop :justatest: 00:51 <+bridge_> [ddnet] also it was made in cracked photoshop :justatest: 00:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] nobody needs to know that 00:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] delete msg 00:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] no u 00:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Its best skin 00:53 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Corona wasnt a big deal to her, she still has her therapies and so 00:53 <+bridge_> [ddnet] it made harder for me to work tho 00:53 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and get money 00:53 <+bridge_> [ddnet] thats why i requested again 00:55 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Hope she being alive till 120years 00:56 <+bridge_> [ddnet] thanks :heartw: 00:57 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i hope that as soon as i get out of this situation, ill try to give back that money tho 00:57 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> :hd_konsti1: :GWaobloChildPepeCry: 00:57 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> no 00:57 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> I donated for her life i dont want it back 00:58 <+bridge_> [ddnet] :justatest: youll never find out that i did 00:58 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> 00:59 <+bridge_> [ddnet] now kiss 00:59 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 👨‍❤️‍💋‍👨 01:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Ravie it'd be cool if you could license your skins under either CC-BY-SA, CC-BY or CC0 01:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 01:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] BY means that others have to credit you when they share the skin. 01:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 01:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] SA (share alike) means that if someone else modifies the skin, they also have to give permission to share etc. 01:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] don't really care about getting credit for them 01:08 <+bridge_> [ddnet] (in fact I'd rather nobody knows I made them xD) 01:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] CC0 is without mandatory credit 01:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @heinrich5991 how far is the rls on steam? 01:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Do you know that? 01:09 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yeah that's fine, how do I make it official? 01:12 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> can u even rls on steam? 01:12 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> didnt they change something 01:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Trafalgar Law release is currently uncertain 01:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @heinrich5991 @Whis wants to give license 01:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Ravie either write here or on github that you release your skins as CC0. note that you also have the x_spec skin, but CC0 would be fine for that as well (but you can also do something else there if you want) 01:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] use them if you want, you have all my permissions for it (CC-BY) @heinrich5991 01:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] cool, thank you @Whis 🙂 01:26 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Why are we doing the licensing thing? I really don't care what people do with my stuff on the internet as long as they are not being dicks. People know I don't mind and I won't sue them. I always took teeworlds stuff be it code or assets and used/modified it. I knew the creator wouldn't mind, often they were long gone and I wouldn't be able to ask them anyways. If we're putting of a few maps under non-restrictive licenses we are indirectly 01:27 <+bridge_> [ddnet] all of my skins currently included in ddnet client (kitties and x_spec) are licensed under CC0 01:30 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @timakro maps fall under copyright whether we acknowledge it or not. we're probably not going to go over all past maps and check with their authors, and rather the lack of takedown requests as permission to host them. we were made aware of some of the copyright problems by trying to publish on steam, so we're working to get everything we ship with the client properly licensed and perhaps also future maps 01:33 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Only a few maps like Kobra are shipped with the client 01:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yes, two 01:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Kobra 3 and Goo! 01:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/issues/2519 01:34 <+bridge_> [ddnet] is only about mappers who contacted us about map licenses 01:40 <+bridge_> [ddnet] CC-BY matches my "don't be a dick" philosophy, so hereby my maps are under CC-BY (can't speak for my co-mappers). 01:40 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 01:40 <+bridge_> [ddnet] But I don't believe bringing up licensing is a good idea for the teeworlds community. I understand that it's necessary for steam, but for everything not concerning the steam release if it was for me I wouldn't just not touch on the subject. 01:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] CC-BY matches my "don't be a dick" philosophy, so hereby my maps are under CC-BY (can't speak for my co-mappers). 01:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 01:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] But I don't believe bringing up licensing is a good idea for the teeworlds community. I understand that it's necessary for steam, but for everything not concerning the steam release if it was for me I would just not touch on the subject. 01:41 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @heinrich5991 <- 01:42 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ah, thanks 🙂 01:42 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Im not the only mapper of Not Adrenaline 6 01:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Silex is the main mapper and me and and stormphoenix are comapper 01:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] oops, didn't read properly 01:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] thanks for the note 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @timakro why is not a good idea? 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] oh come one @Ryozuki 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we had this discussion five times already ^^ 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i seriously still dont know why 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] do you really want to start another one ^^ 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i want to know 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > But I don't believe bringing up licensing is a good idea for the teeworlds community. 01:49 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I think that summarizes it 01:50 <+bridge_> [ddnet] because people will think about licenses and that can lead to outcomes timakro doesn't like 01:51 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Yeah I might have stated my opinion on that before, I don't remember :D 01:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] not sure, but we had a discussion similar to this like 5 times in the last weeks ^^ 01:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] not with you though 01:53 <+bridge_> [ddnet] i still havent seen a proepr argument tho 02:00 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Wow you can edit these kinds of checklists in github issues just by clicking them ... I'm sure there are more people like me who wonder why they can click it and accidentally edit something (don't worry I changed it back) 02:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] we have a history, should be good 02:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] note that only people with access to the repo can click the checkboxes 02:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] ik ofc 02:11 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> I think license can be good to avoid Aoe discussions a la "DDNet sux, delete my maps" 02:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] you can still be annoying about it with a license 02:52 <+bridge_> [ddnet] How can I add fast download for DDNet clients to my 0.7 bridge mod? 02:53 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Ah, I think I have it 03:13 <+bridge_> [ddnet] aoe wanted ddnet to delete his Maps? 03:28 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> yes 04:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] rly? xd 05:38 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Show proves or fake 07:46 <+bridge_> [ddnet] yes 08:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Its true and was a big discussion years ago. 08:31 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> DDNet refused to delete them :kek: 08:33 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> https://forum.ddnet.tw/viewtopic.php?t=2902 09:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @heinrich5991 it was fair fro ryozuki to ask. @timakro's argument wasn't an argument either 09:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] This whole discussion has been plagued by people scared of the boogeyman 09:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > But I don't believe bringing up licensing is a good idea for the teeworlds community. 09:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] "I don't believe" many things, you don't see me putting it out there without any arguments backing my opinion 09:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] > DDNet refused to delete them :kek: 09:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] DDNet had no right to refuse to delete them but alas I'm no lawyer, maybe if I close my eyes hard enough the law will cease to exist and it'll all be sunshine and rainbows 09:37 <+ChillerDragon> So do we need licenses from every mapper? :D 10:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] If we want the right to "refuse to delete" yes but I'm fine with the old maps being susceptible to takedowns 11:34 <+ChillerDragon> u can get a public domain or CC0 for my maps if you want :) 11:35 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> @heinrich5991 11:51 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://twitter.com/ares_emu/status/1284328853171605508 12:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] <ᶰ°Konͧsti> Someone close #2516 pls 12:02 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://github.com/ddnet/ddnet/issues/2516 12:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] :feelsbadman: 12:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] There always was a sentiment in this community (I guess it's the sentiment of the old internet) that everything is up for grabs. I genuinely believe there is truth to that AND that this could be translated into lawyer speech: Implied consent, common law? For example the map takedowns: I'm not a lawyer and I don't know how to phrase it but we all agree with the point: By submitting your map to ddnet you agree that it's hosted on their serve 12:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 12:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] That's just how I see it, I don't know what the real verdict would be if it came to it. But I'm sure it can't be a simple binary "you loose because copyright" argument. 12:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 12:18 <+bridge_> [ddnet] So what I'm saying is all maps are de-facto free to use and I believe with enough effort and a good lawyer we could slap a copyleft license onto the entire ddnet catalogue. Surely no one wants to do that and it's not going to happen among other things because there is no incentive right now to act. Just the same way as there is no incentive for making a list to collect licensing information of ddnet maps. The people declaring their maps co 12:19 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 @Ryozuki 12:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] There always was a sentiment in this community (I guess it's the sentiment of the old internet) that everything is up for grabs. I genuinely believe there is truth to that AND that this could be translated into lawyer speech: Implied consent, common law? For example the map takedowns: I'm not a lawyer and I don't know how one would phrase it but we all agree with the point: By submitting your map to ddnet you agree that it's hosted on thei 12:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 12:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] That's just how I see it, I don't know what the real verdict would be if it came to it. But I'm sure it can't be a simple binary "you loose because copyright" argument. 12:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 12:20 <+bridge_> [ddnet] So what I'm saying is all maps are de-facto free to use and I believe with enough effort and a good lawyer we could slap a copyleft license onto the entire ddnet catalogue. Surely no one wants to do that and it's not going to happen among other things because there is no incentive right now to act. Just the same way as there is no incentive for making a list to collect licensing information of ddnet maps. The people declaring their maps co 12:23 <+Learath2> I agree that by submitting your map you agree that it'll be hosted on our servers. I don't see how it also implies that you can't want it taken down later. E.g. by uploading my pictures to a image host (which usually still do make you agree to some terms btw) I don't give away all rights to that picture 12:25 <+bridge_> [ddnet] this is where u need an actual lawyer 12:25 <+Learath2> I've contacted one, hoping he won't quote me an entire arm and leg because you are having lulz 13:59 <+bridge_> [ddnet] It's not because the maps are not under licence they are not protected. In fact, if someone can argue the property of one, the map is protected my the right of author. Even with licence this doesn't change. What you need is a public agreement to give the right to ddnet to use the map. 14:00 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Ddnet is not even association or enterprise ... So this going to be difficult 14:03 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://www.plagiarismtoday.com/2014/12/09/revoking-creative-commons-licenses/ 14:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] The Practical Implications 14:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 14:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Legally, the answer couldn’t be more clear: Creative Commons Licenses are irrevocable. 14:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 14:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] However, there are some practical application points worth discussing, even if they don’t change anything legally. 14:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 14:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] First, many, if not most, works licensed under Creative Commons are not used. If a work hasn’t been used under the license and the license is removed, no one will be able to use it in the future unless they recall the license and use it later. However, most won’t know or recall the license and will either never have been presented with the license, such as with new visitors, or otherwise won’t be aware of it. 14:05 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Lionheart you are wrong 14:16 <+bridge_> [ddnet] I'm not wrong totally, just partially 14:17 <+bridge_> [ddnet] But it's fun to see you consider all what i say wrong because i say one thing wrong 16:00 <+bridge_> [ddnet] If you don't license something explicitly to grant rights to others, you reserve all rights 16:01 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Lionheart I'd rather if people decided on their own how to license their works, but we could also work with something like an agreement e.g. a license that you agree to when you publish work on ddnet, like wikipedia does it 16:33 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Great the lawyer I picked is on vacation... 17:04 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 yeah, it's that, either you licence your work under thing like creative common, so ppl can use it under the rule of licence, or you give a explicit agreement for your work be used. It's not a licence but a contract between the mapper and ddnet. 17:06 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Either is better than just closing our eyes really tight and pretending the internet is a lawless wasteland 17:12 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Hum, it's not really "our" but your. Because if ddnet is not an organization, it's mean your personally responsible of outrage ^^ 17:15 <+bridge_> [ddnet] In fact, i don't see someone attack ddnet or admins for something so trivial. It's wasting money, and in final, maybe it's going nowhere. In true, i find that politic bad. If we say "Okay, by propose your map you agree to give the right to ddnet to use it unlimited of time, you keep right on it, but you can"t ask us to remove the map. Do you agree" it's okay for me. But if you say today to mapper their map cannot be removed, since they d 19:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Learath2 I got some reports from players that the votes still has a bug. 19:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] If sv_vote_majority is 1 and the vote failed, the vote is not going away: 19:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://i.imgur.com/7pslXC4.png 19:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 19:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Also if someone vote there comes a random msg xD? 19:43 <+bridge_> [ddnet] https://i.imgur.com/bdK5mjX.png 19:44 <+bridge_> [ddnet] There comes 2 msges if someone start a vote 19:44 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Oh that looks off 19:45 <+bridge_> [ddnet] @Trafalgar Law is there a message when the vote fails? 19:45 <+bridge_> [ddnet] Nope 19:45 <+bridge_> [ddnet] and is it not going away for 0.6 either? 19:45 <+bridge_> [ddnet] For 0.6 its going away 19:46 <+bridge_> [ddnet] 0.6 get a msg that the vote failed