00:09 < goo> Evening
02:37 <@deen> goo: hi
02:37 <@deen> goo: any progress with the servers?
02:57 < goo> might get a vps
02:58 < goo> id like to know, would you allow a website to connect to the database to retrieve stats?
02:58 <@deen> I don't quite understand
02:58 <@deen> You want the stats on a separate website? Is http://ddnet.tw/ranks/ not enough?
02:58 < goo> to get records/times, the current teeworlds.co.za website would get lots of changes because of this changes to wage
02:59 <@deen> you could do that, yeah, i guess
02:59 <@deen> but ddnet has a bit of a different table layout than regular ddrace
03:00 <@deen> http://forum.ddnet.tw/viewtopic.php?t=33&p=87#p92
03:02 < goo> ok, database stores more than just top 10 records?
03:03 <@deen> Yes, all
03:03 <@deen> Every time you finish
03:03 <@deen> http://ddnet.tw/players/deen/
03:06 < goo> what are the limitations to the servers if they are organised by you? 
03:07 < goo> e.g. only maps from ddnet map pack? or there can be more maps added to vote list?
03:08 <@deen> Yeah, they all run the same maps, but new maps can be suggested on our forum
03:08 <@deen> adding more maps on just 1 server would be a problem, because the databases are synchronized across all servers
03:10 < goo> even under another heading, because i see hitomi, so maybe "other" or "custom"? or will it add records to database regardless of map heading or server difficulty?
03:10 <@deen> We have a very extensive collection of maps though
03:10 <@deen> Would still be the same. Why are you asking?
03:11 < goo> yes, it is over 500 maps xD ended up writing small script to write to a vote lists
03:11 <@deen> are you trying to set up the server on your own or why?
03:11 < goo> but i didnt know how you made a checkbox for server difficulty
03:12 < goo> was going to run servers using the ddnetserver.exe, but that was before finding out i might be able to get access to a vps
03:12 <@deen> ah, ok
03:13 <@deen> Yeah, I have some scripts that automate all this vote list creation
03:13 < goo> votelist is similar to ddnetwork's with a few extra maps
03:13 < goo> but it hasnt gone live yet, and today i hear i can get a vps
03:13 <@deen> Maybe you can suggest those extra maps on the forum
03:13 <@deen> and we can get them looked at and add them to all servers
03:14 <@deen> If you think they are good there must be a reason for that
03:14 <@deen> If it's easy maps, we really really need more easy maps
03:15 <@deen> Noobs play the same 10-20 maps on ddnet all the time
03:16 < goo> on wage its also like that, but always aip race
03:16 < goo> same 3 maps, amor race, aip race and commando
03:17 <@deen> Well, we'll get a new good novice map on sunday at our novice tournament
03:17 <@deen> So, the VPS would be hosted by your isp?
03:18 <@deen> Would you give me access for setting up the servers then?
03:18 < goo> yes
03:18 <@deen> Great
03:18 <@deen> Database access for a website is no problem
03:18 <@deen> especially read-only
03:19 <@deen> we don't have any secret data in the database
03:19 <@deen> it's all public on the website anyway
03:23 <@deen> We generally have pretty light administration at ddnet. Not much banning or using power at all. What did you plan about that?
03:25 <@deen> Zodiac always said SA needs more administration because of the way people behave. But what I've heard about the WAGE Admin discussions made me wonder about that
03:27 < goo> hm, its hard to explain, whether or not to run without an admin presence
03:28 < goo> i think it was simply because people wanted to push the boundaries, but how is a blocker dealt with, just to ask an example
03:30 <@deen> People vote for a kick and he gets kicked
03:31 <@deen> Which works fine until we have 60 people on a single server
03:31 <@deen> then noone knows who's actually blocking and votes don't work any longer
03:31 < goo> and language, like racism?
03:31 <@deen> but that rarely happens
03:31 < Shorefire> Once you get more than 30 or so people in the server most just press f4 out of instinct :/
03:31 <@deen> Shorefire: hi there =)
03:31 < Shorefire> \o
03:32 < Shorefire> Going to attempt to compile ddnet on my raspberry pi
03:32 <@deen> goo: I tell the person to overthink his opinion and try to explain him why
03:32 <@deen> goo: if he's just talking shit to troll, people will usually ignore him or kick
03:32 < Shorefire> From what I've seen, most racism/bad language is on the American servers
03:32 <@deen> Definitely
03:33 < goo> shore, we are trying to get server up in south africa
03:33 <@deen> I can't go there without being insulted every few minutes
03:33 < Shorefire> deen: same, haha
03:33 < goo> and there is allot of directed racism
03:33 < goo> alot*
03:34 <@deen> I don't know enough about the situation in SA
03:34 <@deen> If you think it's really necessary to have stronger administration, I guess we can go with that
03:35 <@deen> But administrators' judgements are wrong so often. I've had valid complaints about every single adminstrator we have had
03:35 < goo> lots of kiddies, the country in general seems to have an angry populace, players cant handle losing and rage/swear, and the swearing includes racism quite often
03:36 <@deen> And even kicked people myself and only realized it was a mistake afterwards
03:36 < goo> i normally investigate for situations i wasnt there for from tbefore the start, i usually have console_output_level 2 and set the log file
03:37 <@deen> I think if you treat people like they're reasonable, they rather behave like they are
03:37 < goo> im not sure about the situation of the admins completely, i left wage to focus studies in jan 2012
03:37 <@deen> Those investigations sound time consuming
03:38 < goo> and rejoined about a month ago
03:38 < Shorefire> deen: How much ram do your servers have?
03:38 < goo> each server has its own log, i used to just take a look at messages from when the "offending player" joined
03:39 <@deen> Shorefire: check http://ddnet.tw/status and click the servers at top
03:39 < Shorefire> Hm, that doesnt list how much ram they have
03:39 <@deen> yes it does
03:39 < Shorefire> Just % used
03:39 <@deen> click the servers
03:39 < Shorefire> Oh neat
03:40 < goo> did you see that network ger jumped to 100% for a few secs
03:40 < goo> i mean the cpu
03:40 < Shorefire> yeah
03:41 < Shorefire> Woah, the Russian servers only run on 242MiB 
03:41 <@deen> goo: I prefer working on the client and server to checking logs for every troll
03:41 <@deen> Shorefire: and unlimited Bandwidth!
03:41 <@deen> Shorefire: and apparently a 10 Gbit/s connection
03:41 < Shorefire> Heh
03:41 <@deen> Shorefire: really fun server for 5$/month
03:41 < Shorefire> I used to run my server on a 15mb/s connection and it was fine for anyone in England
03:42 <@deen> goo: actually of our thousands of players i can only think of 2 people worth banning by myself
03:42 < Shorefire> Really?
03:42 <@deen> yes
03:42 < Shorefire> Who might I ask?
03:42 <@deen> Crysis and nealson
03:42 <@deen> But not always
03:42 < Shorefire> Ah, Crysis the kid from the blocker servers?
03:43 <@deen> Their behaviour fluctuates
03:43 <@deen> Sometimes they play fine
03:43 < Shorefire> I always see him blocking people, lol
03:43 <@deen> Sometimes they rage and think everyone is against them and start blocking
03:43 <@deen> and hours of discussions haven't helped
03:44 <@deen> Last time nealson blocked on the testserver
03:44 <@deen> and shortly after startes talking about killing gays and women
03:45 < Shorefire> I'd say Crysis is worth banning with the amount of hassle that guy has caushed
03:45 < Shorefire> 9/10 times I see him he's either blocking or trying to piss people off, lol
03:45 < Shorefire> How would I compile just the ddnet server on my pi?
03:45 <@deen> Yes, but I still won't ban him, because 1/10 times he's playing fine, even helping people
03:45 <@deen> bam server_release
03:46 <@deen> but it needs some boost i think
03:46 < Shorefire> What files do I need for the server?
03:46 < Shorefire> Because I've not got much storage on my pi, don't want to copy the 90mb client/server over
03:47 <@deen> huh?
03:47 <@deen> the source directory is 90 MB?
03:47 < Shorefire> Apparently
03:47 <@deen> that's a lot
03:47 <@deen> You don't need data, backup, docs, other
03:48 <@deen> oh wait
03:48 <@deen> other you need ;)
03:48 < goo> data will be the biggest, due to skins
03:48 <@deen> Yeah
03:48 < Shorefire> Alright
03:48 < Shorefire> Data was 12mb
03:48 < Shorefire> 3mb now, yep that's better.  lol
03:48 <@deen> you probably deleted too much of other
03:49 <@deen> it has all these weird libraries for every platform
03:49 < Shorefire> Ah ok
03:49 <@deen> wait
03:49 <@deen> if you don't need mysql you can delete other
03:49 < Shorefire> Other is 72 mb
03:49 < Shorefire> Alright
03:49 <@deen> yeah, damn huge mysql library
03:49 <@deen> no idea why
03:50 < goo> deen, i dont think ive tested, but does ddnet sources include ddnet-server_sql.exe?
03:50 <@deen> personally i would probably compile in a virtual machine and copy the binary
03:50 <@deen> goo: no, doesn't
03:51 <@deen> compilation on windows didn't like to work and i don't know if anyone even would use it
03:51 < goo> the ddrace sources compiles ddrace-server_sql.exe, so the mysql part was removed?
03:51 < goo> oh i see
03:51 <@deen> Yeah, I removed that
03:51 <@deen> It would increase the download a lot
03:51 <@deen> and noone uses it
03:51 < goo> i used to have a windows ddrace sql server that worked and connected
03:51 < goo> but couldnt find any that worked, even from my old backups of 2011
03:51 <@deen> ok
03:52 <@deen> weird
03:53 < goo> will give it a bash in my holidays coming up in a month
03:53 < goo> got a busy week for varsity projects ahead
03:55 <@deen> I'm going to sleep
03:55 <@deen> Good night
03:55 < goo> lol, its 4 am for me, i need sleep too, cheers
03:57 < Shorefire> Alright it's compiling...I think
03:57 < Shorefire> Probably going to take some time
03:59 < Shorefire> deen: You can add me to the map testers if you want
03:59 < Shorefire> (and the mappers too :3)
12:57 <@deen> Shorefire_: Added you to mappers
12:57 <@deen> About testing, go try testing some maps and finding all bugs first. It's kind of difficult
13:04 < Shorefire> Alright :)
13:04 < Shorefire> Wont be on today most likely, installing my new psu soon then heading to bed
13:18 < Shorefire> I'm somewhat used to looking for bugs.  I've been making games for about 6 years now, I know how much of a pain in the ass it can be lol
14:46 < Shorefire> New psu installed \o/
18:10 < Saavik> blödsinn
18:10 < Saavik> deen
18:11 <@deen> aha
18:12 < Saavik> :*